Holmgren Turns Down Seahawks Offer

[Hawk096]

According to Seattle Times Danny O'Neil Holmgren turned down the offer due to a smaller financial terms than the Browns are offering, but also because he wants full control over the team. It now appears his return to Seattle is out of the question and the only true question will be... when will he sign with Cleveland?

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

What We Know and What We Don't

Have fun in the Mistake by the Lake! He will be mired in mediocrity for the rest of his career now.

 

[Hawk096]

If he just wants $$ I don't think his heart is truly in the game anymore and I don't want him.

 

[Fenom]

If he just wants $$ I don't think his heart is truly in the game anymore and I don't want him.

I agree Hawk. The same goes with many players in the NFL right now. A lot of them are all about the money, not about playing in the NFL. Look at Jake Locker. He turned down a possible Top 5 spot in the next draft to go back and help the Huskies get a bowl game. He's playing for the love of the game, not for the love of the money.

 

[Striker]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d ... nfirm=true

Heart broken...

We offered him a senior position (what the fuck does that entail?), while the Browns offer him the world. I see this as a move for covering our asses. Offer him a job we know he would turn down, as it is far inferior to what is currently offered to him, is just a way of saying we don't really want you but we damn sure don't want it to look like we didn't try.

That is what it looks like to me, just a PR move to cover our asses...

I feel sick.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

He was offered President of Football Operations, the same position Tim Ruskell had. It is obvious the Seahawks were not ever going to offer him the keys to the world like Cleveland is. Nor should they. In my opinion, they should not have even offered him anything at this point.

 

[Striker]

Time will tell if we made the right decision. I personally do not like where we are at or where we are going, but I will hope that a year or two from now everyone here can tell me I told you so. Much rather our team succeed than be right on any subject.

What I believe...

We have made the wrong decision, and we will regret it.

Here is hoping I am dead wrong.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

Holmgren was the one that made the decision. He wanted Ruskell's job, was offered it, and he declined it.

 

[Striker]

He turned it down, but I doubt it was because the deal was so good. It would have had to be far below what the Browns offered to make him turn it down. What we did not offer I can only speculate, but I believe we should be the team to offer and want him more than the Browns or any other team for that matter.

The decision was on us to match the offer and we did not. He will take the best offer and I can only assume it has something to do with being able to hire/fire coaches (Mora).

 

[Seahawk Freak]

I agree with Striker. I have a feeling that Holmgren wanted Mora out. He blames Mora for the split in the locker room his last year. The only way he was coming back was if he could bring in Gruden to coach.

Just my opinion.

It is pretty clear now that Mora is going to get another year. God I hope they are not going to use Mora to bring in Vick, and use our 2- 1st rounders to fix the O-line.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

You are assuming that the Seahawks had the same job opening that the Browns did, which is simply not true.

And let's go with your assumption that it had to do with the ability to hire/fire coaches. If he really wanted to be here, he would have given Mora another year. That is not a big ask. If he wanted to choose the entire staff, that IS a big ask. He as a former coach should know that is bullshit.

 

[Striker]

If the position is not available, make it available. I believe he is worth it to do so. I do not believe he would give Mora a second year, but I do believe it is insane to ask a coach to fix every problem his first year. Is it fair to one and done Mora? No it is not, but is Mora the best coach available for our team? No he is not. There is too much on the market to risk everything on a coach who has done so little as an NFL head coach.

Mora seems like he does not belong as a HC in the NFL, and to tell someone who is supposed to have the power to hire/fire coaches that he cannot fire a coach he feels in incapable of leading his team to the Superbowl is not truly offering him a job in the first place.

This ofcourse is all speculation, though I do believe it has something to do with the decision Holmgren made. I am sure there were other factors in their negotiations, I simply believe we did not make a real attempt at obtaining Holmgren. This looked more like a PR move to cover our ass as I said before.

As for the idea of Gruden coaching I have a few problems with that. One would be he has just extended his contract with ESPN. The second reason is we are sitting on two first round picks and Gruden wants Tim Tebow, and has stated that he believes Tebow is the future of the NFL. I happen to disagree strongly with that assumption and do not believe Tebow will survive long in the NFL. I would hate for Gruden to waste our picks by overvaluing a QB and setting us back. I do like Gruden, I just think at this time he is not the coach I would choose for the Seahawks, much like I would not choose to keep Mora.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

So what if it was a PR attempt? You have given nothing in all your pro-Holmgren dialogue that indicates he would be any better than someone else. So why should an entire organization bend at the whim of one man? A man who was average, at best, as the GM the first time. A man who took SEVEN YEARS to get us one playoff win. The Seahawks gave him SEVEN YEARS and they cannot give Jim Mora two? Find me another coach that lasted seven years without a playoff victory.

 

[Striker]

What I give you is a Coach who took us from one of the worst franchises in NFL history to one which is respected and a contender. A coach who took us to more playoff games than all our coaches combined. A coach who took us to our ONLY super bowl since we first arrived in the NFL in 1976.

How many years are you willing to go back to mediocrity? How long will you be willing to wait for another playoff appearance? Another Super Bowl? He has done for us what NOONE else has done, not one coach has done it. He brought us our QB of the future, he brought us our O-Line, he made us something more than laughable. Holmgren is the ONLY thing that has ever worked for us, and we toss him aside for what? Tell me why you think Mora will be the one who saves us again?

What do you see in Mora that gives you any belief that he will do anything more than what every other coach in our history other than Chuck Knox and Holmgren which is fail. I love my team, but damnit I do not want to return to the days of being laughed at. Maybe your happy with tossing aside one of the few good things that we ever had, but I am NOT.

The man wanted to continue to be apart of the organization which he help breath life into and we now somehow have the impression we are too good for him, that we don't need him, and that we are somehow so well off that we cannot even come close to matching an offer another team makes for him. He put himself out there to us saying he wanted to be here, and we simply use that to appease the masses who want him to return instead of taking a serious shot at it.

I am angry, not just from the loss of Holmgren, but because I honestly feel my team is going in the wrong direction. I am from a long line of football fans, football is more than just a sport to us. So believe me when I say I take this PR bullshit to heart when my own team gets caught up in its own success to forget about how much hardship we went through to make it here. I love the Seahawks, but when we are wrong then we are wrong, and I feel we are dead wrong for this decision.

Go Seahawks! Miss you Holmgren! Miss you Zorn! Miss you Hutch! And once again here is hoping I am so wrong that every single one of you can tell me "I Told You So!" Because if I am right then we are in for another 10+ years of mediocrity.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

What I give you is a Coach who took us from one of the worst franchises in NFL history to one which is respected and a contender. A coach who took us to more playoff games than all our coaches combined. A coach who took us to our ONLY super bowl since we first arrived in the NFL in 1976.

You did not address the point I made about SEVEN YEARS. It took him SEVEN YEARS.

How many years are you willing to go back to mediocrity? How long will you be willing to wait for another playoff appearance? Another Super Bowl? He has done for us what NOONE else has done, not one coach has done it. He brought us our QB of the future, he brought us our O-Line, he made us something more than laughable. Holmgren is the ONLY thing that has ever worked for us, and we toss him aside for what? Tell me why you think Mora will be the one who saves us again?

I want that all now. And your blinded fandom of Holmgren leads you astray from one vital point. He did that as a coach. Not an executive high up. Holmgren didn't find any of the great quarterbacks he coached. He only coached them. Someone else had the eye to find them. Do not confuse the two.

What do you see in Mora that gives you any belief that he will do anything more than what every other coach in our history other than Chuck Knox and Holmgren which is fail. I love my team, but damnit I do not want to return to the days of being laughed at. Maybe your happy with tossing aside one of the few good things that we ever had, but I am NOT.

I have no idea what I see in Mora. I do not know what makes a head coach awesome. If I did, I would be running a football franchise. And I don't think you love your team. I think you love players and coaches that comprise, or rather used to comprise, "your team." Holmgren as a COACH was one of the MANY good things we have had. Holmgren as a GM was not. 9-7, 6-10, 9-7, 7-9. Holgren's first four seasons as a head coach for the Seahawks. Why in God's name did we not fire him??? Would you have been defending Holmgren after those seasons? Everyone in Seattle wanted him gone.

The man wanted to continue to be apart of the organization which he help breath life into and we now somehow have the impression we are too good for him, that we don't need him, and that we are somehow so well off that we cannot even come close to matching an offer another team makes for him. He put himself out there to us saying he wanted to be here, and we simply use that to appease the masses who want him to return instead of taking a serious shot at it.

If he truly wanted to be a part of the organization, he would have accepted the role. Period. Making him out like the incredible, flawless guy you continue to is starting to make me sick.

I am angry, not just from the loss of Holmgren, but because I honestly feel my team is going in the wrong direction. I am from a long line of football fans, football is more than just a sport to us. So believe me when I say I take this PR bullshit to heart when my own team gets caught up in its own success to forget about how much hardship we went through to make it here. I love the Seahawks, but when we are wrong then we are wrong, and I feel we are dead wrong for this decision.

I do not think you really understand the organizational structure of the Seahawks whatsoever. There is a reason the 1990s were the way the were. And it wasn't because we did not have Holmgren as a coach.

Go Seahawks! Miss you Holmgren! Miss you Zorn! Miss you Hutch! And once again here is hoping I am so wrong that every single one of you can tell me "I Told You So!" Because if I am right then we are in for another 10+ years of mediocrity.

If there is one lesson you should have learned from Ruskell, it is that you cannot live in the past (i.e. like with Walter Jones). Holmgren, Zorn, and Hutchison are all the past. Quit dwelling on it. And there is no way to know if you are right or wrong.

 

[Striker]

I love both my Seahawks and the coaches and players around the league that I respect. I have stood by the Seahawks since I was 6 years old and intend to do so till the day I die or the team is gone.

Me and you have always had opposing ideas and or opinions on about everything we ever post about. I am not here to say that since our opinions differ that you are not a Seahawks fan, I am sure you love your team as much as I do otherwise you would not feel the need to defend it so passionately.

I do dwell much on the past for several reasons, I do not want to make the same mistakes as before. Holmgren in his first 7 years with us lead us to 3 division titles, 2 runner up seasons, and 4 playoff appearances, and a Super Bowl appearance. This alone was better than anything we had seen in a long long time. He followed that up with 2 more 1sts before his final poor season where his "foot was halfway out the door."

Even during taking the division the 2 years after the Super Bowl we could already see a steady decline from the bad decisions of GM Ruskell. Losing Hutch was one of those major factors as was resigning Alexander to his lucrative deal. Trading for Branch wasting our first round pick was another mistake that hurt us. Despite the rift between Ruskell and Holmgren, Holmgren played out his contract and was loyal to us.

Holmgren was one of only 5 coaches in history to ever take 2 or more teams to a Super Bowl as a HC, and none of them have ever won with two different teams. He is a rare coach and deserves every bit of respect I have given him. Was he the greatest GM, no but he did do some good things, such as the trade for Matt and the drafting of Hutch.

As for the issue of him bringing in the QB's he has coached what you say is partially true. He was never the GM who drafted the QB, he however was apart of the decision to draft/trade for some of these QB's. Walsh and Holmgren were close and bringing in Steve Young had a bit to do with the fact Holmgren had coached him in college, thus the trade from Tampa. Ron Wolf had originally planned to draft Favre back with the Jets and when ATL planned on trading him Wolf who was now with GB sent Holmgren to ATL to scout Favre where Holmgren told Wolf he wanted him. Wolf made it happen even overuling the medical decision about Favre's hip condition. While still in GB Matt was drafted to back up Favre, soon after Holmgren left for Seattle where he later traded for Matt. Holmgren has an eye for QB's to think his track record is coincidence is ridiculous.

If there was ever a time for Holmgren to move on to the next step in his career which would be on the management side instead of coaching side it is now. He has mastered his craft, and he is ready for the next step.

There is much I do not understand as you say, and I do not believe I know everything, I do however believe Holmgren is the right choice and we made the wrong one. You differ and that is fine, we are both emotional and I will respect your opinion, but I do not believe you are right.

One thing stays the same, I am loyal to my Seahawks. If you think I am not, then on that you are dead wrong.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

The difference between you and I is that you think Holmgren is some miracle cure and I don't buy it. It is that simple. There are far more talented people than Holmgren at this type of position that will be available. We just need to make sure we pick one.

Sorry for challenging your fandom. I should not have done that. Your black and white attitude is just a mystery to me because I do not think it is as easy as hiring Holmgren = return to relevance.

 

[Striker]

Not a problem I didn't take offense. It is not so much I think he is a magic cure all, I just believe he works. So many people fail in this league, and for years we were amongst those who never could make the cut. I just don't want to see us go back to those days, nor do I want to wait another 7 years.

The big question is where do we go from here? If there are better people out there who are they? Also, would those better people be willing to take a job where they do not get to decide who the HC is? I just have no clue who it could be...and messing this decision up could cost us many years of solid football.

Anyone have a clue?

*Found a list of current staff of all NFL teams it may help*

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_current_National_Football_League_staffs"]List of current National Football League staffs - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[SeahawkWag]

I don't think he got as much control ie Pres and GM
The first report I saw it was a lesser role than Fuskell :roll:

Holmgren was the one that made the decision. He wanted Ruskell's job, was offered it, and he declined it.

 

[SeaHawksHuddle]

Read my link in towards the top of the thread. Pam Oliver on the broadcast just said she talked to Tod Leiweke and he said he offered Holmgren total control. Could it really have been about the money?